In this episode of Jesus and Jetlag, hosts Mike Hartman and Matthew Doebler interview each other, diving into the ambitious yet humbling call to plant a church body rather than a single congregation. They share their experiences as missionaries in Australia and the UK, reflecting on how their calls encompass entire countries, similar to early missionaries called to whole continents like South America.
Key discussion points include:
Broadening the Scope of Ministry: Mike and Matt emphasize that their mission is to bring the Gospel to regions, not just individual communities. They discuss the challenges of reaching millions of people in places like Mexico City and China, highlighting the impossibility of one person doing it all.
The Importance of Multiplication (PARB): The conversation centers on building capacity for Gospel ministry expansion through multiplication. Matthew introduces the PARB framework:
P - Partners: Making witnesses and disciplers, not just converts and disciples.
A - Apprentices: Raising up new leaders through an apprenticeship model.
R - Repeats: Developing simple, repeatable methods for sharing the Gospel, citing Martin Luther's catechism as a historical example of this principle.
B - Broadens: Constantly thinking broader than immediate communities to reach more people through various means.
Balancing Depth and Breadth: Mike and Matt explore the tension between deep, thorough training and broad, rapid evangelism. They advocate for a balanced approach that ensures the Gospel message remains clear and unchanged over time while still reaching as many people as possible.
Leveraging Modern Communication: Mike shares how he uses platforms like YouTube and TikTok to connect with people and generate interest in the Bible in the UK, adapting communication methods to reach a wider audience. Matthew also discusses using English classes to connect with immigrant populations in Australia.
Encouragement for Missionaries: The episode concludes with powerful encouragements, reminding listeners that ministry will have struggles, it's God's church not ours, and it's okay to make mistakes and learn from them. They differentiate between "lead measures" (controllable actions) and "lag measures" (results that are God's work), advocating for missionaries to "work hard and rest well".
Listen in as Mike and Matt offer practical insights and theological reflections on the joys and challenges of global Gospel ministry.
Relevant Links:
Mike’s YouTube Channel “Discover Hidden Gems”
The new church body Mike is helping to form in the U.K.
Common Terms and Links on Jesus and Jetlag
WELS = Wisconsin Evangelical Lutheran Synod (wels.net)
WLS = Wisconsin Lutheran Seminary in Mequon Wisconsin (wisluthsem.org)
BWM = WELS Board for World Missions
CICR = Commission on Inter-Church Relations of the Wisconsin Evangelical Lutheran Synod
Vicar = a pastoral intern in the Wisconsin Evangelical Lutheran system
Wisconsin Lutheran Quarterly (WLQ) - A theological journal, published by Wisconsin Lutheran Seminary, that aims to serve pastors and theologians with scholarly articles, book reviews, and reflections on contemporary theological and pastoral concerns.
Pastoral Studies Institute of Wisconsin Lutheran Seminary
All commentary, statements, and discussion on this podcast reflect the knowledge, insight, and experience solely of the individuals presenting and featured on the podcast.
